need help: FM145 clutch-related

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lilBro
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need help: FM145 clutch-related

Post by lilBro » Mon Aug 01, 2005 8:26 am

I am in the process of putting in a new Hays clutch kit, T/O bearing, pilot bushing, and a new slave cyl.

In the process the hydro tube from the master to the slave cracked, so I'm waiting to get that part so we can finish this morning.

I urgently need to know two things in order to complete this:


1. Which direction does the clutch disc go in??
The Haynes and Chilton manual are both too damned obscure, and the images conflict with the 'tech' in this regard.
The Hays clutch comes with no kind of directional indicator that I can find.

The center of the clutch disc that holds the springs is 'more flat' on one side, and raised a half inch or so on the other.
Does the clutch disc go on with the raised side to the flywheel/flat side to pressure plate?.... or does it go in with the flat side to the flywheel/raised side to pressure plate?



2. Does the pilot bushing get pressed into the flywheel while installed on the motor?... or does it get pressed into the crank BEHIND the flywheel, which would require removal of the flywheel in order to install a new bushing, or remove the old part.

The manuals are equally vague on this: in the picture they are pulling the bushing out of the flywheel on the motor, but the text instructs to press it into the crankshaft..however it appears to be impossible to pull the bushing THROUGH the flywheel, and obviously you can't install it in the crank without removing the flywheel first.


Thanks in advance
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Nobody
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Post by Nobody » Mon Aug 01, 2005 8:46 am

The raised portion of the clutch disc typically points away from the engine. Usually, it won't even fit the other way.

The Pilot bushing can be installed in the flywheel or the crank shaft. I think BII's can in both configurations depending which transmission was used, and the input shaft length. I can't say for sure your on application, although it's easy enough to figure out. If is appears to be behind the flyweel, then it probably is in the crankshaft.

Here's a tip on removing the flywheel. Use a small piece of chain and anchor the flywheel to the block. That way the engine won't turn over as your breaking the bolts loose and torquing them on install.

Make sure you use a torque wrench on the flywheel and pressure plate bolts. On the pressure plate, tighten the bolts in star pattern a little at time so the pressure plate clamps down evenly.

lilBro
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Post by lilBro » Mon Aug 01, 2005 9:15 am

Nobody wrote: The Pilot bushing can be installed in the flywheel or the crank shaft. I think BII's can in both configurations depending which transmission was used, and the input shaft length. I can't say for sure your on application, although it's easy enough to figure out. If is appears to be behind the flyweel, then it probably is in the crankshaft.
Yeah see there's a part of my problem: after 180k miles of use, the old bushing had literally disintegrated, and we don't have a point of reference for that.
We tapped it into the flywheel, because it doesn't appear the shaft will be able to reach it in the crank.
And of course there's no mention in the manuals of removing the flywheel and installing the bushing...just using an internal puller and slide hammer, then tap the new one in place w/ the seal facing the trans.
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Post by Nobody » Mon Aug 01, 2005 9:49 am

Maybe put in a call to ford parts.

If it's not supposed to be in the flywheel, the input shaft should bottom out on the bushing and prevent you from bolting up the tranny.

I can't believe there is nothing left of a pilot bushing....crazy. I think I'd be a little concerned about the condition of the tranny.

I believe my 2.8L / toyokogyo had the pilot bushing in the crank, but that was a long time ago.

lilBro
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Post by lilBro » Mon Aug 01, 2005 2:20 pm

Looks like the original clutch as well.
If the bushing dried out with age, I guess I could see it happening.

I'm sure the tranny isn't too much longer for this world, hope to hold out for a TK, if I can ever stop nickel-and-diming on the other perishable parts..
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Post by OCD4B2 » Mon Aug 01, 2005 3:22 pm

The pilot bearing is pressed into the flywheel. I am doing this right now too, I just went and got my flywheel resurfaced and now I am pressing in the bearing as I speak. I think your gonna have to take the flywheel off though, would be impossible to take it out when its still bolted to the back of the crank........
230,000 miles and she still turns heads

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Post by lilBro » Mon Aug 01, 2005 9:23 pm

Well This should make it interesting:

I took Nobodys advice, and called a local ford place, and asked for someone who could help w/ a technical question. They passed me around until I finally got a tech, who had this to say:

Pilot bushing goes in the crankshaft, you must remove the flywheel to put it in.

Is there a groove in the end of your input shaft, about 1/4 inch from the end?


The dude agrees though, "tall side of clutch ring goes toward the pressure plate."
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Post by Nobody » Tue Aug 02, 2005 5:09 am

If you're doing a new clutch, it would be stupid not to have the flywheel resurfaced. Why don't you want to pull it? It's like 5 bolts or whatever.

I wouldn't put a whole lot of faith in what the tech told you, unless he looked it up in some book. He was most likely just telling you that they generally go in the crank.

What comes up for your pilot bearing when you plug your specs in at the parts store? That's what I was getting at when I said call ford. I just meant ask the parts dept what bearing is used in your application. They should have been able to give you a part #. Even their pictures on the microfish probably won't show where it goes. The are just generic pictures. Once you have have the thing in your hand, you'll see it only fits the flywheel OR the crank.

I think you're making this more difficult than it is.

lilBro
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Post by lilBro » Tue Aug 02, 2005 7:13 am

I think you're missin my objective, my bad.

The reason I'm asking so intently about the pilot bushing is because the old one got wasted and it appeared to have been in the flywheel, so I was trying to prevent it from happening again by double checking our work.

The flywheel has been off a couple times now, resurfaced & cleaned, loc-tited and torqued (after replacing the block rear freeze plug) the bushing is already in the flywheel and everything is together (don't remember the pn, Napa part) just waiting on a clutch line.
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Post by Nobody » Tue Aug 02, 2005 7:36 am

Gotcha ;)

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