clutch problem...

DBrown · Post by **DBrown** » Fri Feb 24, 2006 6:19 am

well, I am glad to say the the EB is alive! finished hooking up all the little junk yesterday but I am having a problem....

something is going on with my clutch or transmission. I put new bushings in the linkage and have adjusted it threw the complete range and it is still not working.

here is whats up:

with the transfer case in neutral it will shift threw all the geas except reverse, it wants to grind when you try to go into rev. with the transfer case in gear it will not let you go into any gear from neutral.

if you start the truck in any gear you have a little grab from the clutch, and can move the truck but you can't shift out of the gear.

I know I am probably going to have to pull the transmission to get to the bottom of this but I am kind of wanting some opinions before I go there so I know what to look for. I have replaced the pressure plat and disk when I put in the motor. to me it sounds like the clutch is just not fully letting go but it doesn't make sence when the linkage is adjusted all the way out? does that make sence? bad pressure plate maybe? if I wasn't paying attention and installed the disk backwords would that cause this problem?

Post by **Nobody** » Fri Feb 24, 2006 6:35 am

Definately sounds like the clutch isn't disenguaging.

Have you tried to disenguage it by hand underneath? When it disenguages completely, you should feel a bit of a "breakover".

How much movement is there on the fork arm before the throwout bearing contacts the pressure plate? It shouldn't be much.

How much does the peddle move before you get any pressure?

Maybe you have the wrong linkage, so the ratio is off.... 6cyl vs 8cyl. I can get some measurements off of mine if you need it.

EBSTEVE · Post by **EBSTEVE** » Fri Feb 24, 2006 8:03 am

It sounds to me like Nobody has it, try shimming where the rod meets the fork and give it a shot to see if more throw will fix it, might just be that the rod does not have enough length

.

Post by **Nobody** » Fri Feb 24, 2006 10:04 am

Wasn't your Bronco setup for a 6cyl? I assume you put in your own V8 mounts. If your engine placement wasn't right, the linkage would be off. Probably easy enough fix to lengthen or shorten. I think your clutch is probably fine.

I checked JBG and sure enough there is a different Z-bar for 6cyl and 8cyl.

http://broncograveyard.com/bronco/i-112 ... lutch&sy=6

http://broncograveyard.com/bronco/i-112 ... lutch&sy=6

EBSTEVE · Post by **EBSTEVE** » Fri Feb 24, 2006 10:31 am

IIRC the 6 to 8 is 1" different for drivetrain lenght so..........

DBrown · Post by **DBrown** » Fri Feb 24, 2006 2:52 pm

the peddle is solid at the top and you can feel a "break over" just like you said.

I had someone comment on the v8 bracket but I couldn't get any one to give me a length over on classicbroncos.com. I do however know that my truck was a v8 truck because I decoded the vins on the door jam and the glovebox. I think the title was just misprinted. also I got 3.50's so that was not an option from the factory with the 6.

I tried to make a longer adjusting bar and it didn't work, made it about 4.5" long so I got room to cut it down if needed. but I can adjust it to the point of not moving when started in gear, and it still gives me the same result. that is why I am thinking something is wrong. I am going to back it out one more time and get it right so I can at least move it on to the trailer so I can level it out and set up my shock mounts but then if I have to I am going to pull the tranny and transfer case on that so I don't have to lay in the gravel any more.

this is realy frustrating...it just sounds like it's not letting go 100% and still making the input shaft turn....any other ideas?

Post by **Nobody** » Fri Feb 24, 2006 3:35 pm

Try disenguaging the fork arm by hand....you'll probably need to figure some way to get leverage on it.....or like EBSTEVE suggested, shim the linkage where it hits the fork arm. Just for testing it's ok if the clutch is partially disenguaged. What you want to see is how much additional throw you need to fully disenguage the clutch. Sounds like you are close if you feel the breakover.

It is possible you didn't attach the throwout bearing to the fork arm correctly, or maybe you have the wrong throwout bearing, which is burning up some throw because it's too short or something.

But the first thing you need to figure out is if you can make it disenguage completely. Just be careful and don't squish yourself!

edit:
What's your VIN #?

wilber · Post by **wilber** » Fri Feb 24, 2006 4:44 pm

if you installed the clutch disc the wrong way it could cause this also. so double check that when/if you pull it all apart

DBrown · Post by **DBrown** » Fri Feb 24, 2006 5:33 pm

U15GLK23xxx

I know it is probably common knowledge at the court house but I didn't realy want to post the rest...

I actualy created a different part for the linkage since the stock piece was a little wobbly and not quite going to the end. it is extended about 1.5"

I adjusted it all the way to make sure it was totaly disenguaged and nothing. the same symptoms, just no movement when starting in gear and relecing the clutch peddle. peddle stops before it goes all the way to the floor so I don't think any adjustment is going to fix it.

I thought about the throw out bearing...my clutch arm does move around a little when disconnected from the linkage but I just assumed it was normal for a little. it is the clip on style.

I am thinking I am just going to have to investigate...I am probably going to pull it apart this tuesday. the tranny has to be good if it is pulling in all the gears so it has got to be in the bell housing... I I got a budy that works the counter at the parts house so I will take all the clutch parts in so I can compair to what they got...

I am afraid that I did put the disk in wrong...but I can't remember. I was moving kinda fast when I was putting the motor in....

wait, if I am using the dia. style pressure plate should I be using the same throw out bearing from a dia. style clutch?

tekatlarge · Post by **tekatlarge** » Fri Feb 24, 2006 6:07 pm

DBrown wrote: wait, if I am using the dia. style pressure plate should I be using the same throw out bearing from a dia. style clutch?

Absolutely.. Sounds like a lack of travel at the diaphram. If I remember corectly there are two bearing styles too. There is a short one and a long one maybe you need the oposite the one you have.

Post by **Nobody** » Fri Feb 24, 2006 8:08 pm

Are you using the metal plate between the block and the bellhousing?

I wonder if it's even possible to put the disc in backward.....

So even if you adjust/shim the linkage to the point that the clutch is partially disenguaged, you still can't get full release when you push the peddle?

DBrown · Post by **DBrown** » Sat Feb 25, 2006 5:33 am

yeah, I got the plate in there. I was always told on a ford you had to have it.

yes, if I adjust it all the way it will still not go. it acts like it is because the truck will not pull it self in gear, but it does the same thing, by not letting you shift in and out of gear. its like the input shaft is still turning just enough to stop you from doing anything...

I guess I am just going to have to pull the tranny and inspect everything. I will post up and let y'all know what I find...when I pull it I am just going to buy a new throw out bearing and I might even pull the top cover off the tranny to check it also.

I guess I am going to do the shift rail mod on the D20 while I got it all out also. you should turn the info you posted into a write up on that, it was some good stuff...wish me luck!

EBSTEVE · Post by **EBSTEVE** » Sat Feb 25, 2006 7:31 am

Well if the pedal is not hitting the floor and the clutch is not engaging and you are sure that the linkage you made is not hitting or binging then it's either wrong parts or wrongly installed parts (I am captain of the obvious).
I hope it's obvious like the arm or throw out bearing came off.

One thing I just thought of, is it the three speed trany? if so have you ever driven it?
The reason I ask is because there is something about shifting them when they are out creating some sort of problem.
I took my three speed out and never looked back so I don't know much about them, I think that a bearing falls into the case or something but might be worth googling so you don't pull it apart and stuff it back together just to find it was the trany.

Post by **Nobody** » Sat Feb 25, 2006 8:14 am

I'm not sure you completely understood.

I wanted you to shim the linkage beyond what you can adjust it, so there is pressure on the fork arm, even when the peddle is released. Put a spacer between the linkage and the fork arm.

Did you do that?

DBrown · Post by **DBrown** » Sat Feb 25, 2006 8:37 am

yeah, the linkage I made does just that...it extends the stock linkage by about 1.5". when the peddle is at the top it is actualy half disenguaged and the fork is maxed before the peddle can hit the floor. where it is adjusted now it could actualy adjust out another inch or two, and it is already maxed.

yeah, I am going to run the 3speed for a little while. ever since I had the truck the tranny and transefer case have been mated. I think the problem comes when you pull them apart. I think it is suppost to be in 1st gear to hold pressure on neddle bearings to stop them from dropping out or something.

to eliminat the tranny from the equation I am thinking I will pull the top cover off when I get it out to inspect it. probably throw some paint on it and some new gaskets too. I will probably do some painting to the frame also.